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The Antiquity of the Elder Futhark 
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Joined: Thu Aug 09, 2007 5:01 pm
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Location: Vinland
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Rather than a long post, we can address one question at a time.

Regarding a stave, that is an archaic word meaning stick or staff. The runes, when they are cast or thrown, are typically cut into wood sticks or staves. I always use wood from a tree that has produced fruit. Other trees are also used.

Here is a quote from the web:

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Runes, runic alphabet, rune-stave. The early *Germanic peoples used a runic alphabet which was different from the Roman alphabet we use today. It is generally known as the ‘futhark’ after its first six characters or rune-staves. It was used for carving on wood or stone, and the runes therefore consist of straight lines. The early futhark had 24 letters in its rune-row or alphabet, but the Anglo-Saxons added letters which were needed to represent their own language. Many examples of runic carvings on crosses, name-stones, swords, etc. survive.


Tue Jun 02, 2009 6:47 pm
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Hail Brothers.
First of all, staining does just what it suggests. It stains the colour of the wood, and depending on the method you use it can also serve to preserve the wood. As for the discrepancy twixt the number of runes and the 18 rune magics of the Havamal, I agree in that I likewise believe the 18 song/spells mentioned are an application of more than one rune, likely incorporating other elements as well. Remember that while the runes themselves are known, their true power and proper use was always a mystery, even in the old times, and was known only to a few. I do not have my sagas with me at school, so I cannot accurately reference, but I recall an instance in which a youth (Ragnar may have been his name) had learned to use the power of the runes, and this was a contributing factor to his eventual kingship. Therefore I find it almost undeniable that the 18 magics Odin learned were more involved than simple usage of the runic alphabet; that there is a missing element which distinguishes rune magic from the usage of runes in the literary sense.


Tue Sep 15, 2009 8:15 pm
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According to germanic Philology as studied over here (and nothing in my "other" experience has led me to believe otherwise) the elder futhark is the oldest dating to the second century B.C at the earliest.

Some symbols were already present further back and had been slightly altered and incorporated.
The use of the runes as a full-blown alphabet was most likely inspired by contact with the etruscans, whose alphabet is powerfully similar if one sees it. There are some examples in museums, and I have found they too hold a certain... something.


the language used by the Elder Futhark is extremely similar to protogermanic, the reconstructed language from which English, German, Norse, Dutch etc derive.
The signs were later diminished for phonetic reasons, as was the addition of others in Anglosaxon. Both of these alphabets came about when contacts with Xtianity had already taken place (the anglosaxon dates to when conversion was pretty much completed)

the elder Futhark is by far my favourite.


Tue Nov 08, 2011 5:36 pm
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What Odin rode the tree for nine nights to obtain was not an alphabet. Rune is not the proper name for the Futhark letters. Rune stave or just stave would be a more proper term. Rune can be found in all the major germanic dialects. As well as in some celtic ones most likely as a loan word. In all dialects Runa means mystery or secret. The root word meant to whisper or roar and it is related to vocalisation and galdor magic.


Tue May 14, 2013 2:34 am
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Post Re:
Vortigern wrote:
I second the problems encountered by Myrddin Draconia. I believe 'consectate' was meant to say 'consecrate', but apart from that I too have little understanding of staves and staining and singing and doing whatever you meant about earth, air, fire and water. Anyone able to expand upon this for us newcomers?


Staves are like sticks of wood rather than discs or slices of a branch. Both in ogham and in runes it is common to cut staves (small sticks) from a branch of a tree to carve your runes or ogham onto. After carbon the runes, you can stain them (the carved symbol) with color or blood, etc. Or you can burn the runes on with one of those pyro tools. Forget what it's called. When finished, you can protect the wood staves with oil or with a clear stain if you like. I'd go with something natural as opposed to stain, personally. As for the ritual stuff, maybe someone else can better explain, as I'm not very experienced in that sort of thing.


Mon Aug 01, 2016 12:52 pm
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Edgewalker wrote:
What Odin rode the tree for nine nights to obtain was not an alphabet. Rune is not the proper name for the Futhark letters. Rune stave or just stave would be a more proper term. Rune can be found in all the major germanic dialects. As well as in some celtic ones most likely as a loan word. In all dialects Runa means mystery or secret. The root word meant to whisper or roar and it is related to vocalisation and galdor magic.


Edgewalker, can you elaborate? I find this very interesting, and would love to hear your thoughts. What do you think it was that Odin obtained if not the futhark letters?


Mon Aug 01, 2016 12:58 pm
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Can anyone recommend any really good websites that provide in depth explanations of the runes? I'm interested in the elder futhark.


Wed Aug 03, 2016 10:44 am
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Fand wrote:
Can anyone recommend any really good websites that provide in depth explanations of the runes? I'm interested in the elder futhark.


I have found Edred Thorsson's Handbook of Rune Magic helpful in gaining a better of the Elder Futhark. There are several online sources. Few websites do a good job of giving an in-depth explanation, but rather gloss over what the author considers the most prominent aspects of the individual runes.

Read everything you can, this will broaden your understanding for what is possible for the runes. The more you work with them the more you will see the nature of the effect they have in your life.


Fri Sep 16, 2016 4:30 pm
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Tyrsman wrote:
Fand wrote:
Can anyone recommend any really good websites that provide in depth explanations of the runes? I'm interested in the elder futhark.


I have found Edred Thorsson's Handbook of Rune Magic helpful in gaining a better of the Elder Futhark. There are several online sources. Few websites do a good job of giving an in-depth explanation, but rather gloss over what the author considers the most prominent aspects of the individual runes.

Read everything you can, this will broaden your understanding for what is possible for the runes. The more you work with them the more you will see the nature of the effect they have in your life.


Thank you tyrsman. :)


Thu Sep 29, 2016 8:18 pm
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Fand wrote:
Can anyone recommend any really good websites that provide in depth explanations of the runes? I'm interested in the elder futhark.


Http://atlantisrisingmagazine.com/artic ... -imagined/


Sun Oct 09, 2016 2:46 pm
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